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Colonel_Coo
04-01-2006, 12:17 PM
I wanted to discuss and get feedback on the impact of Aircraft on the Eastern Front.
After playing the Russians for 5 games at 100 points and 200 points I built an Germany 200 point army that I was afraid of as the Russian player.

To stop my opponent's IL-10's from ruining my thin skinned tanks and my SS-tank's back armor rating, I am using:
two 20mm Flak38 and two Luftwaffe Infantrymen.
Placement of these units is problematic as you need to figure where your tanks will be after they move and prior to the enemy aircraft coming in to kill them. Forcing the IL-10 to attack from 2 hexes is much better (5 dice verus 7 dice) than having it up close and personal. The movement speed of the two soldiers amounts to 2 hexes. You should plan where you end up at with the tanks with that in mind.

In order to HUNT enemy aircraft, Cossack Captains, ZUS guns etc, I am using
Two ME-109's
Having initiative and going second is a great way for the Germans to keep the IL-10's from ever showing up to begin with. My opponent last night learned this on the first turn. He brought in his IL-10 to kill a lone Elite. My two ME-109's came right up on his tail. Disrupted Elite Panzer IV and 1 DEAD IL-10. :)

In order to finsih off Soviet Straglers and Partisans, I brought in
Two BMW R75's
At a speed of 5, these units are more a mental threat to straglers and disrutped tanks than a real batttlefield threat. Without a WOL giving them the Angriff their role is limited. These units are a nice counter to enemy soldier formation and protecting flanks, but on their own, they are not so good.

The motorbikes are very fragile. Planes of any type can kill them and can do so relatively safely from medium range.

Being German, the standard anti-tank team goes right in for me.
Pak-40, SS H'Fuher, Sniper
Because of the threat of Aircraft, enemy soldiers and light tanks, I brought in
two SS-Panzergrenadiers and 1 MG42 Machine-gun team
to provide a beat stick at the Soldier level.

My tank force consist normally of
three Elite Panzer IV Ausf D and one SS-Panzer IV Ausf F2
But last night I modified this to give me an extra Luff-Inf and a sIG-33 in replacement of one of the Elite Panzers.

So I actually brought in
two elite panzer IV, one SS-panzer F-2, and one sIG-33

These little tanks are miricle workers. Especially protected by airpower and supported by a sniper.

Dr.Cornelius
04-01-2006, 10:05 PM
Colonel- Your army is reasonable, but other than a single WE Sniper, you apparently have no answer to heavy tank like a JS-2. Also, I was surprised that you did not take at least one Stuka. After investing 28 points in air superiority fighters, you might as well take a ground attack plane.

And I think you opponent could have done better than one Sturmovik. Experience will show that in 200 points it is better for the Russians to take either zero or 2-3 Sturmoviks, but not just one.

Here is how I would put together a 200 point Russian force that is set up to be competitive against three types of armies:

Infantry Heavy: Parabomb or SS+HStFü+PAK+Sniper
Medium Tank Swarm: Sherman/Rhino/Stuart or EPIV/Stug/SS-PzIV
Heavy Tanks: Tiger/KT or KV-1/JS-2 or Pershing/Croc

The Russian's best combo is KV-1 +Cossack Captain, so lets start with that. Bringing a Cossack Capt guarantees that the Russian's chances of winning initiative are not worse than 40%. I also like the Synergy that the Red Army Forward Observer brings against infantry and aircraft, so lets go with one on another KV.

two Sturmoviks to hunt enemy armor, aircraft and Snipers.
One or two 82mm mortars to counter infantry.
T-34/85 or SU-85 against heavy tanks.
T-70 matches up well against EPzIV.

The Doctor's 200 point Russian Army
64 KV-1 x2
66 T-34/85 x2
42 Sturmovik x2
11 82mm Mortar
08 Red Army Forward Observer (on KV-1)
09 Cossack Captain (on KV-1)
200 points

I encourage you to playtest your build against this army. I think you will be surprised at how well it does against the Germans.

Colonel_Coo
04-01-2006, 10:35 PM
We play restricted builds here. No mixing anyone with the Soviets.

I like your heavy Soviet punch. I think in those scenario's my 4 tanks would not live as long.

We only have 1 IL-10 among us (mine)
My addition of 20mm Ack Ack's was to eliminate the air-threat to the Pak/Sniper squad.

I cowarded like rats against the initial rush. In the batttle, the Motorcycles were a nice counter to the dual T-70's I faced. As a result, we both lost both (two T-70's and two BMW's).

I lost my sIG-33 to AT guns (he lost way more to my sIG-33) and I lost 1 and only of my two Elite tanks.

I like facing heavy armor as the games go much quicker.

If the anwers on the Q/A board shows that the sIG-33 Blast/Bombardment works as written, I will carry the build forwards as noted. (2 Elites, 1 SS, 1 sIG)

BTW, the Soviet cavalry is inferior to the Polish in just about every way.

Zhukov
04-02-2006, 02:30 PM
Colonel- Your army is reasonable, but other than a single WE Sniper, you apparently have no answer to heavy tank like a JS-2. Also, I was surprised that you did not take at least one Stuka. After investing 28 points in air superiority fighters, you might as well take a ground attack plane.

And I think you opponent could have done better than one Sturmovik. Experience will show that in 200 points it is better for the Russians to take either zero or 2-3 Sturmoviks, but not just one.

Here is how I would put together a 200 point Russian force that is set up to be competitive against three types of armies:

Infantry Heavy: Parabomb or SS+HStFü+PAK+Sniper
Medium Tank Swarm: Sherman/Rhino/Stuart or EPIV/Stug/SS-PzIV
Heavy Tanks: Tiger/KT or KV-1/JS-2 or Pershing/Croc

The Russian's best combo is KV-1 +Cossack Captain, so lets start with that. Bringing a Cossack Capt guarantees that the Russian's chances of winning initiative are not worse than 40%. I also like the Synergy that the Red Army Forward Observer brings against infantry and aircraft, so lets go with one on another KV.

two Sturmoviks to hunt enemy armor, aircraft and Snipers.
One or two 82mm mortars to counter infantry.
T-34/85 or SU-85 against heavy tanks.
T-70 matches up well against EPzIV.

The Doctor's 200 point Russian Army
64 KV-1 x2
66 T-34/85 x2
42 Sturmovik x2
11 82mm Mortar
08 Red Army Forward Observer (on KV-1)
09 Cossack Captain (on KV-1)
200 points

I encourage you to playtest your build against this army. I think you will be surprised at how well it does against the Germans.
If I were you I always think its nice to have a PPSH or Soviet Grenedier on my tanks, I would try and add that in.

Dr.Cornelius
04-02-2006, 03:58 PM
If I were you I always think its nice to have a PPSH or Soviet Grenedier on my tanks, I would try and add that in.The new Soviet Grenadier is a nice tank rider, but nowhere near as effective as the broken Cossack Capt/KV-1 combo.

If I was not fielding a Red Army FO (mostly to test its effectiveness), I might go with a Grenadier on the second KV and a Cossack Cav to fill the points. But then again, the Cossack Captian is so dominant against infantry that it is tempting to go with a second one.

The idea behind the army is that the T-34/85s are tough enough to lead against a Sherman/EPzIV swarm and also pack enough punch to take on a Tiger/KT/JS-2/Pershing/Croc. The KV-1s are the second line, with guns strong enough to engage the swarm, and 6 armor & hulking mass to take a punch.

The Sturmoviks are there to hunt the dreaded WE Sniper and also to take out thin skinned tanks and commanders. They can also shoot down Stukas, the only aircraft that seriously threaten the Russian medium/heavy tanks.

The Sturmoviks should go for enemy planes first, then WE Sniper and AT guns. The 82 mm mortar is vulnerable to tele-trooper attack, but careful placement and 'bodyguarding' should allow it to take out a tele-trooper before going down. Also note that the tele-trooper that takes out the mortar is unlikely to make it to the objective anyway.

The key is that the tanks are tough and efficient, the planes are flexible and that the entire army is nearly immune to infantry attack.