New starters and maps - tentative info!

[Jaels]

I spoke with my FLGS owner yesterday, and she told me she just received an email from Wizards of the Coast with updates, including some about A&AM.

To paraphrase what she told me, it was saying that the current starters are now out of stock, but that new, improved starters would be available very soon. These starters would include 2 boosters, and updated rule book and new maps! She is now trying to confirm it is indeed new maps and not just reprint of the old Alpha, Bravo, Charlie and Delta, but if that is the case, it would make many players (including myself) quite happy.

[ArmyVet]

That sounds GREAT!! Please keep us informed as you receive the info.

Thanks :cool:

[Cruizin2000]

That sounds great!! I wonder how much they'll cost?

C2000

[PatrickWR]

Good news...now that you broke the story, can we get an official confirm from Wizards on this?

[Remember-OWS-]

Jael... Thanks for the info... don't forget your Quebequers players... :)

[cannonfodder]

Any news on new pieces? It seems like a logical time to add a few. Besides, then we'll all have to buy new starters to complete our collections. Shrewd marketing, that.

[NumberCruncher]

If this is true, {and I'm not saying it isn't} WHY, WHY, WHY did'nt/doesn't HAW break the news here?

[spadsept@mac.com]

Jaels... As usual, you are the man! And say hi to Normandy for me! You lucky guy!

[polish_horsy]

perhaps you stole their Wednesday thunder. or maybe Wednesday is the long awaited, much needed, "only need Mons to sign-off on", any day now errata.

[heck99]

Cool. I've been waiting for a new starter.

[Kommandant]

I spoke with my FLGS owner yesterday, and she told me she just received an email from Wizards of the Coast with updates, including some about A&AM.

To paraphrase what she told me, it was saying that the current starters are now out of stock, but that new, improved starters would be available very soon. These starters would include 2 boosters, and updated rule book and new maps! She is now trying to confirm it is indeed new maps and not just reprint of the old Alpha, Bravo, Charlie and Delta, but if that is the case, it would make many players (including myself) quite happy.

thats good

so by the looks of it we should get 18 pieces, 1 or 2 rares

[polish_horsy]

If every starter came with a Higgins plus one other random rare they could go a long way to making D-day playable.

[WotC Bob]

I will be doing an update to the product page later today.

The new starter has the original maps plus two new double sided maps, for a total of 6 double sided maps.

[Kommandant]

I will be doing an update to the product page later today.

The new starter has the original maps plus two new double sided maps, for a total of 6 double sided maps.

sweet :D
thanks Bob :cool:

[Cruizin2000]

I will be doing an update to the product page later today.

The new starter has the original maps plus two new double sided maps, for a total of 6 double sided maps.


That sounds like what they did with Heroscape. Wal-Mart got their own version that had the same stuff except for the Onyx Viper squad that came with this version exclusively.

What am I going to do with 2 more sets of maps A-D? Too bad you can't get the other two maps by themselves...

C2000

[horacus]

Well, definatly I will buy that starter.

[spadsept@mac.com]

sweet :D
thanks Bob :cool:

Great bob! Can't wait to see that! We are glad the game will go on for while...

[FSSF]

And will we be getting the now legendary corrected Hellcat with this new starter?

[Thoes426]

WotC Bob -

Will the rules be updated to reflect the changes and errata that has come about since the games first release?

Glad to see the game continues forward with something new. (2 new maps)

Thoes426

[lozmoid]

I am also looking forward to this new starter pack (and am quietly praying for the corrected M18 Hellcat and a revised rulebook). This looks good...

[Remember-OWS-]

I guess the new maps, plus the old redone, are going to be number maps...

[Predator666]

This sounds awsome. I hope they do have new maps. I plan on buying them as soon as I can if its all true and worth it.

[heck99]

We need more info Bob! When will the update on the wizards site be up? Hopefully soon.

[WotC Bob]

All, it's late here in WotC-land. I got sidetracked today with a separate big project today, but by finishing it, it cleared me to do other work.

My first job and highest priority tomorrow is to do ALL of the following updates to the site:

New Rulebook
Info on New Starter Set
Info on next release
Errata
Update Combat Zone with new kits

I will also put up some small images of the new maps so you know what you would be getting. Hopefully this info will address some of your questions.

[Old Tanker]

:mad: Here we go again tell us something and not follow through

[Old Tanker]

This does not help with your credibility

[MyGarandDoesMyTalking]

Wow. Give Bob a break. He is obviously doing a ton of stuff. The guy needs one more day. We've all been swamped with work before, and needed a little more time to get things in order. I think we can all wait one more day.

['panzer' Mayer]

Wow. Give Bob a break. He is obviously doing a ton of stuff. The guy needs one more day. We've all been swamped with work before, and needed a little more time to get things in order. I think we can all wait one more day.

Second that

[WotC Bob]

Eh, its fair. Its one of the great catch-22's of web work. Promise anything and don't deliver and people get upset. Promise nothing and just deliver things, and people get mad because they don't know what's going on.

[Stojakovic]

Thanks bob! You are the besthttp://img90.imageshack.us/img90/4122/soldierthumbsup2gw.gif

[GraphCorp]

Keep treading water, Bob! Somebodies bound to empty the keg sooner or later!

Thanks for the information!!!

[Remember-OWS-]

At my FLAGS place the manager told me about Dreamblade!!!
Different type of game, but a game of tourney and money, so expect to see less of BOB for the release of Dreamblade...

[Dr_Strangelove]

Eh, its fair. Its one of the great catch-22's of web work. Promise anything and don't deliver and people get upset. Promise nothing and just deliver things, and people get mad because they don't know what's going on.

Excellent Bob, it will be very good to see what has been cooking at WotC.

[ArmyVet]

Thanks Bob. You can't please everyone ...... but it's us who are pleased that matter the most! ;)

[Kaufschtick]

All, it's late here in WotC-land. I got sidetracked today with a separate big project today, but by finishing it, it cleared me to do other work.

My first job and highest priority tomorrow is to do ALL of the following updates to the site:

New Rulebook
Info on New Starter Set
Info on next release
Errata
Update Combat Zone with new kits

I will also put up some small images of the new maps so you know what you would be getting. Hopefully this info will address some of your questions.

That is a great post to read! It hopefully says ALOT about the long term future of this game. Cleaned up rules will be huge! I'm not dogging the rules as they are now, just that there are some issues that could use some clearing up. Along with getting all the current rules and eratta in one document!

[whitewind]

So I am wondering if any of the miniatures are diff in the new starter. Just updated rule book and two new maps...? Wow. So really though if there is all new mini's for this starter folks who are coming on new will be out the old mini's cause I'm sure they will be discontinued. Any chance of getting a map pack with the new rules included?

[Predator666]

Its all good bob. I can't wait to see all of the new things tomorrow. I hope I will be able to download and save the new rulebook. I will also be buying the stats.

[Stojakovic]

At my FLAGS place the manager told me about Dreamblade!!!
Different type of game, but a game of tourney and money, so expect to see less of BOB for the release of Dreamblade...

I thought about getting that game... Saw the minis... half of them are craptastic looking. The other half are sweet. The rules are not all that great. C+ rules. Talk about a game based on luck. Bob we want you here!

[CdtWeasel]

If they want to sell out all they have to do is put T-34's in the starter

[spadsept@mac.com]

So I am wondering if any of the miniatures are diff in the new starter. Just updated rule book and two new maps...? Wow. So really though if there is all new mini's for this starter folks who are coming on new will be out the old mini's cause I'm sure they will be discontinued. Any chance of getting a map pack with the new rules included?


Maybe an Hellcat in all of the starters, instead of shermans!

BTW, thanks Bob for the update... we can wait till tomorrow ( i might not get much sleep, but... :) )

[Stojakovic]

I won't get much sleep knowing the heat are the champions. :mad:

[Old Tanker]

Good answer Bob, I will back off

[oddfellow]

great news. I will most definitely be purchasing one of the new starters when they come out. great news indeed!

[Dr_Strangelove]

I really want to see what the revised rules look like. It would have excited me a lot if they were revised and expanded rules.

The one sentiment that I keep seeing is that more maps be created and the quality of miniatures be controlled and improved. If they can do this I'll definitely be excited.

[Cruizin2000]

Wizards should put dice into the starter set like they have in Heroscape. Have one series with 3 marked sides for sucesses and the other three sides are blank. Then have another die for cover rolls and one for disrupted units to use. Anyone every try this? It's just easier on the eyes to pick out the good rolls from the bad ones.

C2000

[Kaufschtick]

Wizards should put dice into the starter set like they have in Heroscape. Have one series with 3 marked sides for sucesses and the other three sides are blank. Then have another die for cover rolls and one for disrupted units to use. Anyone every try this? It's just easier on the eyes to pick out the good rolls from the bad ones.

C2000

Unless the dice get mis-scaled and they come out like those dinky ones from that pirate game! :D Just kidding, couldn't resist! :D

[Cruizin2000]

Unless the dice get mis-scaled and they come out like those dinky ones from that pirate game! :D Just kidding, couldn't resist! :D

It's all about size with you, Mr. Five Rulers. :D

C2000

[Kaufschtick]

It's all about size with you, Mr. Five Rulers. :D

C2000

LOL! :D That's too funny... five rulers...:D

[Stealth]

Wizards should put dice into the starter set like they have in Heroscape. Have one series with 3 marked sides for sucesses and the other three sides are blank. Then have another die for cover rolls and one for disrupted units to use. Anyone every try this? It's just easier on the eyes to pick out the good rolls from the bad ones.

C2000

But what happens when you add Crack Shot to the mix? Other SA's that make you hit on a 5-6 only? :D

[Cruizin2000]

But what happens when you add Crack Shot to the mix? Other SA's that make you hit on a 5-6 only? :D

Ok, so we'll need 4 new dice. Maybe 5 as I just remembered Pinpointer. More coffee, must have more coffee...

C2000

[Kaufschtick]

All, it's late here in WotC-land. I got sidetracked today with a separate big project today, but by finishing it, it cleared me to do other work.

My first job and highest priority tomorrow is to do ALL of the following updates to the site:

New Rulebook
Info on New Starter Set
Info on next release
Errata
Update Combat Zone with new kits

I will also put up some small images of the new maps so you know what you would be getting. Hopefully this info will address some of your questions.

I can not wait to see the new rules and errata! So glad to hear this.

[shadowhooch]

All, it's late here in WotC-land. I got sidetracked today with a separate big project today, but by finishing it, it cleared me to do other work.

My first job and highest priority tomorrow is to do ALL of the following updates to the site:

New Rulebook
Info on New Starter Set
Info on next release
Errata
Update Combat Zone with new kits

I will also put up some small images of the new maps so you know what you would be getting. Hopefully this info will address some of your questions.

That's great Bob! That post above is really all most of us wanted to see....just the fact that something is being worked on and exists. You may have taken away some of the thunder from JW; but maybe he can get more in depth and answer some of the more burning issues and questions on gameplay design and mechanics.

Thanks again and looking forward to the info.

[RBloom0566]

Unless the dice get mis-scaled and they come out like those dinky ones from that pirate game! :D Just kidding, couldn't resist! :D

Hey now! I'll have you know I have over 100 of those "dinky dice."
Granted, I keep them in a Tic-Tac Box, but...*L*

[CdtWeasel]

Maybe an Hellcat in all of the starters, instead of shermans!

BTW, thanks Bob for the update... we can wait till tomorrow ( i might not get much sleep, but... :) )

resized Hellcat and a real Spitfire maybe :p

[Yakumo_Fujji]

Nah spitfire turned into hawker Seafury.

[Yakumo_Fujji]

thats good

so by the looks of it we should get 18 pieces, 1 or 2 rares

Even better Base set 9 2 boosters 18 makes 27 so 2 to 3 rares ?????

Grtz

[Kaufschtick]

resized Hellcat and a real Spitfire maybe :p

You could be on to something there! But I can't help thinking that IF they did this, why would I want to pay for the same thing twice just to get the right piece? Maybe an exchange deal would be better for these two pieces...

[Remember-OWS-]

Forget about the old mismatch and wrong size... just do the next set right. Or do a similar piece with similar stats, but rather different in the way, so we wont have double of a resize redone piece

[Stojakovic]

Forget about the old mismatch and wrong size... just do the next set right. Or do a similar piece with similar stats, but rather different in the way, so we wont have double of a resize redone piece

I agree with that, and the other side. Switch with the corrupted minis. And make the next set better. Much better!

[Cruizin2000]

You could be on to something there! But I can't help thinking that IF they did this, why would I want to pay for the same thing twice just to get the right piece? Maybe an exchange deal would be better for these two pieces...

An exchange deal is the ONLY way to go. Pay for the same thing twice? Nope!!

C2000

[Stojakovic]

An exchange deal is the ONLY way to go. Pay for the same thing twice? Nope!!

C2000

Yeah. Its kind of like how my dad's tv broke in 20 some day. Why would he want to spend another 3500 bones to get it again. I know big price difference but same concept.

[Cruizin2000]

Yeah. Its kind of like how my dad's tv broke in 20 some day. Why would he want to spend another 3500 bones to get it again. I know big price difference but same concept.

Wizards needs to make it right with us. I currently have 8 of those US 3" guns, 2 Hellcats, and 2 Spitschmitts. These need replaced big time!! The 3" gun is just pathetic when you look at it on the maps.

C2000

[Stojakovic]

Wizards needs to make it right with us. I currently have 8 of those US 3" guns, 2 Hellcats, and 2 Spitschmitts. These need replaced big time!! The 3" gun is just pathetic when you look at it on the maps.

C2000

I have 10 of the 3'' guns. I have 2 hellcats. At one time I had 6. and 0 spitmits. So I am guessing they will need to do a lot of reprinting.

[Cruizin2000]

I have 10 of the 3'' guns. I have 2 hellcats. At one time I had 6. and 0 spitmits. So I am guessing they will need to do a lot of reprinting.


And they can do some recycling of the plastic too. It's a win/win situation for all involved.

C2000

[Stojakovic]

And they can do some recycling of the plastic too. It's a win/win situation for all involved.

C2000

Or star a A/H museum. They can display the corrupted minis and the fixed ones. It could be like one of those pics you see with a monkey slowly turning into man.

[WotC Bob]

I'm waiting on a couple pictures from imaging before I can publish all my updates today. Supposed to have them after lunch.

[WotC Bob]

Although you can find the following now.

Revised Rulebook (http://www.wizards.com/avalonhill/rules/AAM_Rulebook.pdf)

D-Day Errata (http://www.wizards.com/avalonhill/rules/AAM_EX3_Errata.pdf)

[jeffgoboom]

Bob that link is the link to Contested Skies Errata

[Remember-OWS-]

And Bob... When do we have to expect the rulebook to be available in Print?
Finally, I should have ask, when is the next Starter Set plan on the market...

September?
Pleasssssssssssssssssssee!!! :o

[WotC Bob]

Link to errata fixed. New starters became available (at least for stores to reorder) June 16th I believe.

[mlund]

New Rulebook is current as of Contested Skies, then, but not D-Day?

I noticed the lack of Canada as a nationality or any mention of Heroes, Gun Transport, or the like.

Not bad. I hope there will be a general trend of rolling new revisions into a PDF rulebook copy available online on a regular basis.

- Marty Lund

[EricM 2404]

Link to errata fixed. New starters became available (at least for stores to reorder) June 16th I believe.


shouldn't the stores have them by now then?

[CdtWeasel]

I doubt many stores will have bought more starters if they still have the first ones on the shelves.

The images of the maps in the new rulebook pdf are the same as what we currently have.

Is there any obvious way to tell the new starters from the old starters?

[RBloom0566]

I doubt many stores will have bought more starters if they still have the first ones on the shelves.

The images of the maps in the new rulebook pdf are the same as what we currently have.

Is there any obvious way to tell the new starters from the old starters?

There is a mention of game scale on the inside cover. That's new, isn't it?
Don't recall the scale being mentioned in the old rulebook.

But still, that would involve being able to open a Starter Box to look at the rules. Probably not gonna happen.

[Hiro]

Anyone else notice the new terrain, shellholes and hedges? Great stuff.

[Pasalades]

Do you think this new demolitions ability makes the Royal Engineers worth using now?

[shadowhooch]

What do maps Able 3/4 and Baker 3/4 look like? I didn't see any kind of picture anywhere. Anyone know?

[Maturin]

There is a mention of game scale on the inside cover. That's new, isn't it?
Don't recall the scale being mentioned in the old rulebook.
No. Scale is addressed on page 10 in both old and new rulebooks.

[fifleche]

June 16th :confused:

Of what year?

Seriously, never heard of that one...

[Maturin]

Is there any obvious way to tell the new starters from the old starters?
Other than the fact that the new starters have 18 miniatures, including two random rares?

[WotC Bob]

My bad, it was June 18th, 2006 and, as someone pointed out, since they are a replacement for the old starter set, some stores may not order them until their old stock sells through.

[mlund]

So Bob, the new Starter Set is just the old Starter Set, with the new Rulebook, right?

Then we've got some sort of packaged product with new maps and 2 boosters coming down the pike at some point?

I assume the two products are not the same, as the Starter still requires the original 4 maps to make its board configurations.

- Marty Lund

[Kaufschtick]

The new starter has 18 pieces. 6 double sided maps.

[WotC Bob]

There is the original starter set. That is unchanged. As supplies sell out it will be replaced by the new starter set.

The new starter set has:
6 double sided maps, 2 of which are new
The new rulebook
Counters
2 Boosters boxes (1 Base Set, 1 Set II)
No dice

[Kaufschtick]

What is the suggested retail?

[mlund]

There is the original starter set. That is unchanged. As supplies sell out it will be replaced by the new starter set.

The new starter set has:
6 double sided maps, 2 of which are new
The new rulebook
Counters
2 Boosters boxes (1 Base Set, 1 Set II)
No dice

Very nice work. I just found myself picking up a Set I and a Set II the other day (pulled a Cromwell IV and an SS Panther Ausf G.!). It'll also give those sets more longevity as booster supplies wind down over the months. Can't go wrong with more maps and counters either.

- Marty Lund

[PatrickWR]

I am very curious about the MSRP.

[Kaufschtick]

I'm waiting on a couple pictures from imaging before I can publish all my updates today. Supposed to have them after lunch.

Are we going to get a peek at the two new maps? Fronts and backs?

One other question if I may, will the starters have a set number of pieces as the original had, only with two random rares now, or will there actually be a booster from sets I & II with all the pieces being random from those two sets?

If 16 of the pieces are set in each starter, do you have that info by any chance? Just curious, not trying to be a pest.

Thanks for all the info WotC BOB!

[Wittmann]

2 Boosters boxes (1 Base Set, 1 Set II)


there ya go

[WotC Bob]

Okay, further updates

MSRP: $24.99, same as old starter.

Also, evidently Contested Skies boosters can be part of the mix as well. The front of the starter pack is cut out so you can see what two boosters are in it before you buy. Picture and update forthcoming.

[Kaufschtick]

there ya go

Yes, it would seem so. Only I was thinking about how in the original starter they gave out a scripted set of pieces, including a Sherman and a Pnzr IV along with a well balanced group of other pieces. Although rare, I have had boosters with duplicates in them. Also a scripted set for the starter always made good sense to me to give a new person as balanced a group of initial pieces as possible.

I'll have to break out the set II checklist, but I'm just curious as to if a starter has all random pieces would there be the rare case where a person may draw a really unusual group of pieces that leave a person with a bad taste in their mouths for the game?

[Kaufschtick]

Okay, further updates

MSRP: $24.99, same as old starter.

Also, evidently Contested Skies boosters can be part of the mix as well. The front of the starter pack is cut out so you can see what two boosters are in it before you buy. Picture and update forthcoming.

Thanks WotC Bob, I guess that answers that question! Same price, more is better!

[Wittmann]

Since they left out the dice, there really isn't "more" in the new starter. Oh well, I guess this starter really isn't for people that are actual "starters", as in completely new to the game.

Glad to see some improvement though (rules).

[RBloom0566]

So this takes care of the new rules, eratta and a couple new maps. With two boosters in the new Starter Set, I am left wondering if these two boosters will be re-introduced over-stock from the original runs or if these will be new boosters with the same titles, containing "fixed" units?

If not, one of the most vital questions remains: What will be done about the incorrect scale minis and the Spitfire to those of us who have them? I know I wouldn't want to even risk buying a new Starter set on the chance of getting a unit "fix."

Are you considering piece-for-piece replacements?

[Predator666]

I can't wait for this starter. I have enough dice but always run out of counters and would like new maps. This sounds so sweet. I can't wait!

[Arpathapius]

.

My first job and highest priority tomorrow is to do ALL of the following updates to the site:


Info on next release


.

Has there been any info on the next set wondering if I missed in the Threads

[Kaufschtick]

If not, one of the most vital questions remains: What will be done about the incorrect scale minis and the Spitfire to those of us who have them? Are you considering piece-for-piece replacements?

I feel your pain. I would have to say that there is nothing in the works on this at the time being.

[WotC Bob]

Okay, put up a small new article with links to the next expansion (Reserves), new starter set info, errata, rulebook and some images of the new maps (Able-3, Able-4, Baker-3, Baker-4).

Combat Zone update will come tomorrow, primarily an update to the retailer kits to bring them up to date, which is where they will stay from now on.

[Lynx7725]

Thanks Bob!

[spadsept@mac.com]

Very nice maps Bob, can't wait to try them... We should have 6 new maps config thought, so we could roll 2d6 to choose a map.

Thanks again for doing your best to satisfy AAM fans! We are a lot who beleive in this game and hopes it go on for a while with nice updates on every level.

[horacus]

Thanks a lot.

[Qmark]

Yes, it would seem so. Only I was thinking about how in the original starter they gave out a scripted set of pieces, including a Sherman and a Pnzr IV along with a well balanced group of other pieces.
[...]
Also a scripted set for the starter always made good sense to me to give a new person as balanced a group of initial pieces as possible.

Yeah, this seems like a legitimate concern. The old 'starter' was a dozen set pieces to skirmish out a handfull of games + a bonus rare. The drive to buy out the store came about from the desire for pure escalation and expansion beyond the default armies.
In contrast, simply marketing two boosters taped together as a "starter" seems a bit risky, as I've had several 'randomized' boosters that came out to be two axis dorks and seven allied greats (or vice versa). There is a very real possibility that one side is going to be grossly dominant right out-of-the-box, and the more likely response is one of distaste and humiliation than "maybe if I had more flamethrowers?".

If this is some sort of underhanded attempt to coerce newbs into buying another booster or two in hopes of finding a way to not get creamed by wonky random booster distribution, then frankly it's a very sloppy plan. Instead, it should have been marketed as: "Two boosters. Better rules. More maps. Five dollar discount."

[Lynx7725]

Took a look at the revised rulebook. Interesting tidbits:

Planes are at 1/240. Which means, comparative to vehicles, their dimensions should be doubled (or their area squared/ volume cubed). If you think the Stuka is already fairly big, they are really much bigger if they are in scale with the vehicles...

No new map configs. Already covered in another thread.

Lots of new terrain stuff. Now sure if the starters would include new hex tiles (I suppose not), so not too sure how useful these rules would be.

Lots of SA erratas are incorporated. You'll need time to read through them. Somewhat amusing. The Paratrooper subtype made it in, but the Hero subtype didn't.... :rolleyes:

I'm still confused by the Hex-side and Fringe terrain thing. Why have two types which are similar to each other?

[Qmark]

Somewhat amusing. The Paratrooper subtype made it in, but the Hero subtype didn't.... :rolleyes:Not overly. It's pretty obvious by simply skimming through the new rules that they were compiled, revised, and probably also typeset and printed before Set4 was finalized.

[jeffgoboom]

The website says 18 randomized miniatures or something like that, but the inside cover of the new rulebook says something like 18 units including 2 randomized rares.

Which is it? Just two different rares and a standard starter or anything goes?

[Maturin]

The website says 18 randomized miniatures or something like that, but the inside cover of the new rulebook says something like 18 units including 2 randomized rares.

Which is it? Just two different rares and a standard starter or anything goes?
It's two boosters.

[Cruizin2000]

How is this starter playable right out of the box when there's no markers and no dice? It's a buy two boosters, save $5, and get two new maps deal. That's just plain wrong. And again, it's false advertising. Playable right out of the box??? My sweet aunt, it is!! Horse feathers!!

C2000

[Lynx7725]

Cruizin2000, have you read the new rulebook?
Starter Set Components
18 prepainted plastic miniatures, including 2 randomized rare miniatures
18 stat cards, one for each miniature
6 double-sided battle-map sections
Hit counters
Rulebook
Only thing missing there is dice, and honestly, dice isn't going to be a big deal IMO.. and WotC did put it very plainly on the site that the dice are not included.

Try not to go overboard tarring WotC hmm?

[mlund]

Try not to go overboard tarring WotC hmm?

It is the only reason some people come here. It gives them warm fuzzies or something.

It isn't like every game store, basic hasbro board game, or drug store doesn't have a ready supply for 6 sided dice. I'm very happy not to be getting another giant wad of boring white dice this time.

- Marty Lund

[Cruizin2000]

It is the only reason some people come here. It gives them warm fuzzies or something.

It isn't like every game store, basic hasbro board game, or drug store doesn't have a ready supply for 6 sided dice. I'm very happy not to be getting another giant wad of boring white dice this time.

- Marty Lund

I'll bet you get the warm and fuzzies too. ;)

C2000

[Cruizin2000]

No problem on not including any dice. I have a TON of those. It's just that this new starter is NOT "playable right out of the box".

C2000

[Wittmann]

Indeed, which won't matter for most of us as we already have armies but for potential new players this might be annoying.

[WotC Bob]

"Ready to play, right out of the box" has always been a reference to the fact that you don't have to assemble or paint these miniatures.

Here is the text from the original base set ad campaign

"All the Guts! All the Glory! None of the Glue

NO PAINTING, NO PREPPING

Just fast-paced skirmish-level combat that rages across the battlefields of WWII. Axis & Allies Mminiatures puts prepainted, 15mm miniatures at your command right out of the box. Rally your men and roll out."

[Wittmann]

While true, the previous starter added to the idea of "ready to play, right out of the box" by providing the new player with two somewhat balanced forces to start playing immediately. This new starter doesn't do that; the new player has no garantuee at all to have a somewhat decent force to start playing with right away. It will encourage some to buy more while possibly putting off others to start out in the first place.

While this starter is more preferable for people that already play the game, it might not be so for potential new players.

[Arpathapius]

Yes we we get what u're saying but for someone getting into the game they will need more than either of the starters has to offer, will need more mini's and if there is a dollar store near, 8 for the buck, I bought more even though they were inculded in the 1st starter so we would not always have to be rerolling dice for 1 attack

[Lynx7725]

Personally, I think it's ok. The 2x Booster draw are from sets that are pretty balanced as things go, so the odds of having a decent army on both sides are good. That takes care of one point.

As for the second point, I agree for a beginner it might not be perfect, but consider these: One, the place where you buy boosters tends to have dice anyway. Dropping the dice out probably allowed the starters to be cheaper and contain more goodies (like more maps than the original starters).

Two, once I had time to sort out the stuff from the revised starter, I'll probably want to get the original starter anyway, because of the fixed units in there. Commanders on both sides, MG42, Sherman, Garand, Bazooka, and Vickers; I'm not guaranteed to get these good units in the revised starter (though the odds are good). In addition, buying an original starter with a revised starter also allow me to booster-draft more easily at the standard 100 points level. And of course, dice. :rolleyes:

I honestly might not be too happy about it, but it does make sense to do that. What's more, it also help LGS owners to move old starters; I see bundled-deals for savvy LGS owners.

[Cruizin2000]

While true, the previous starter added to the idea of "ready to play, right out of the box" by providing the new player with two somewhat balanced forces to start playing immediately. This new starter doesn't do that; the new player has no garantuee at all to have a somewhat decent force to start playing with right away. It will encourage some to buy more while possibly putting off others to start out in the first place.

While this starter is more preferable for people that already play the game, it might not be so for potential new players.

I totally agree with you, Herr Wittman. The old starter had close to 60 points for Axis and 60 for Allies. Just leave out the random rare piece and you have a somewhat balanced game. I can see new players not liking this game due to the new starter unless they can also find the older one.

All we really want, besides the correctly sized and correct pieces, is new map packs. That's all we ask. Is that so hard?

C2000

[sgt. dekkard]

anyone know where we can buy these new starters yet?

[Predator666]

The new starters are more like an expansion pack. To call it a starter doesn't seem right. It needs dice to be a starter set. I believe its more of an expansion and as soon as I can buy one I will.

[GijoeNumberOne]

For new players, I think the new starters are a deal. For the same price, you now get 18 pieces (instead of 12), 2 rares (vs. 1), 6 maps (vs. 4), but no dice (big deal). Plus you get to see what sets are included before you buy.

Like some of you, I would rather be able to buy the maps alone since I already have over 1200 pieces and have no reason to buy any more starters.

[Stojakovic]

"Ready to play, right out of the box" has always been a reference to the fact that you don't have to assemble or paint these miniatures.

Here is the text from the original base set ad campaign

"All the Guts! All the Glory! None of the Glue

NO PAINTING, NO PREPPING

Just fast-paced skirmish-level combat that rages across the battlefields of WWII. Axis & Allies Mminiatures puts prepainted, 15mm miniatures at your command right out of the box. Rally your men and roll out."

Yo Joe!!! :)

[Autarch]

I like keeping dice with the games they came with. That way I can grab a box and go, not spend time hunting for a dice bag or getting to a friend's house and opening the box to see the dice have been cannibalized for some other game.

Plus it seems odd not to include dice in a "starter" set for a game that requires bucketloads of them to be rolled.

This is more of an expansion kit than a starter. And with only two new maps, rules not current for the latest set and boosters from sets I don't need, it's hard to justify a purchase.

[Kaufschtick]

Instead of selling little paper maps, these guys are totally missing the boat on the maps. Let's see, this company has taken about a nickles worth of plastic and paint and has sold it to us all for a small fortune. And we all love it (at least I do so far! :D ).

So lets see, we all now have a whole bunch of cool looking 3D pieces to game out on little paper 2D maps. Seems like someone over there at "plastic to riches" would realize that they could turn another nickles worth of plastic into some cool 3D terrain tiles and sell that to us.

Kinda modularized like the way maps are done in M44' and Battle Cry!. Then they could make another fortune and we would just love that too because now we could make up any old maps we wanted by just buying the new terrain tiles. WotC could even charge us an arm and a leg for the stuff, you just know it would sell like hotcakes! Look at all the 3D layouts people have aready done on their own!

I even remember seeing 3D tree hexes in the first or second Combat Zone kit. I couldn't understand why they never tried to sell the stuff...?

Maybe they feel bad for charging us what they have been on the boosters up to now! :D

[spadsept@mac.com]

Plastic 3-d inter-locking tiles boosters... yes, i could buy that!

[oddfellow]

I'm on board with that too ... 3d interlocking tile boosters would be great. I'd have no problems dropping $$$ on that as long as they are a versatile enough system. It would go a long way to keep the game (which me and my group love) fresh. Cool, I got a munitions dump, bridge and an airfield rare in my booster! (etc). The different sets could be "Eastern Europe", "Africa", "Winter War", "Objectives" etc.... hell yeah I'd buy that!!!

[NEVjr]

I'm on board with that too ... 3d interlocking tile boosters would be great. I'd have no problems dropping $$$ on that as long as they are a versatile enough system. It would go a long way to keep the game (which me and my group love) fresh. Cool, I got a munitions dump, bridge and an airfield rare in my booster! (etc). The different sets could be "Eastern Europe", "Africa", "Winter War", "Objectives" etc.... hell yeah I'd buy that!!!
that would be awsome, 15 or 20 hexes in a booster, with maybe 1/3 of those being clear as commons, and forest/road/whatever as uncommon, and a rare objective type hex in each one

[5thGurkha]

Keep treading water, Bob! Somebodies bound to empty the keg sooner or later!

Thanks for the information!!!

Don't worry. I heard that Bob jumped in the keg and has been out 3 times to
visit the littlest room in the house. :)

[spadsept@mac.com]

Plastic 3-d inter-locking tiles boosters... yes, i could buy that!

and those could be 3"or 4" instead of the actual 2"... So it could be easier to fit aftermarket trees on forest tiles, etc...

[Cruizin2000]

Count me in for 3D interlockable hexes. Just like Heroscape but make them 3". I have two of the Heroscape master sets plus two of each of the expansions that are out now. This game is just the best!! And it looks really nice too. Wizards should do these for sure!! Heroscape tiles do work for A&A minis but only for the soldier figs. I think that the guys at WoTC could retire early if they put out a map set like this.

C2000

[XAos]

Okay, further updates

MSRP: $24.99, same as old starter.

Also, evidently Contested Skies boosters can be part of the mix as well. The front of the starter pack is cut out so you can see what two boosters are in it before you buy. Picture and update forthcoming.
I sure I'll buy one;
But I'd really, really like to know if there is any chance the set-1 booster in that starter could include the correct re-sized hellcat ???????????
Bob ?

[WotC Bob]

The new starter won't have the new hellcat in it as far as I know. Justin is working on an article about the hellcat, amongst other things I believe.

[spadsept@mac.com]

Well, it seems something like that is coming for DDM...at 10$ a terrain "booster" major $$$ will be made there... I wish i could buy AAM terrain "booster" ;)...

Count me in for 3D interlockable hexes. Just like Heroscape but make them 3". I have two of the Heroscape master sets plus two of each of the expansions that are out now. This game is just the best!! And it looks really nice too. Wizards should do these for sure!! Heroscape tiles do work for A&A minis but only for the soldier figs. I think that the guys at WoTC could retire early if they put out a map set like this.

C2000

[whitewind]

Make the terrain hexes bigger yes... 3 or 4".... Make a nice town or objective rare... " Not clear Terrain " LOL... Your right Heroscape can be used for soliers and small tanks....!!!http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b228/rcameron2/DSC00141.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b228/rcameron2/DSC00133.jpg
But not for anything very big unless you just want to deal with stuff being crowded..http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b228/rcameron2/DSC00122.jpg

[horacus]

Nice pics.

[RBloom0566]

Don't worry. I heard that Bob jumped in the keg and has been out 3 times to
visit the littlest room in the house. :)

The attic?

[RBloom0566]

Whitewind:

I totally loved the map depictions ala HeroScape! That's great! You're right that the hexes would have to be 3"-4" however, because you barely have room for units in HeroScape hexes, much less D/D/D markers.

They'd make a killing on terrain, buildings, trees, roads, water, and hills would be cool to emulate, too. Need lots of hex tiles!!!

Robert