Aircraft Carrier Based...or Completely.

[SpeshulK111]

First of all, I'm really excited about this release. Secondly, what are the chances that WAS will allow us to build a fleet based on 2 aircraft carrier with planes and still stay under the 100 pt limit? It's just a thought, and maybe it wouldn't fare well, but it seems mighty cool.

[Joisey]

What size carriers? It already looks like to Essex class carriers will be over 100.

Build point limits were made to be broken, anyway.

[maciej12]

What size carriers? It already looks like to Essex class carriers will be over 100.

Build point limits were made to be broken, anyway.

I agree with you here. 100 points is a good learning or teaching others to play size game but, we all need to grow up into higher levels.:)

[TheFoeHammer]

What size carriers? It already looks like to Essex class carriers will be over 100.

Build point limits were made to be broken, anyway.

Yes but CV-6 Enterprise is only 25 points. Depending on the cost of planes it looks doable in some situations. It seems that big gun battleships will be the most expensive. But I am betting they will be hard to stop without a balanced fleet. Two carriers with no protection but their planes will make for an interesting matchup vs. Battleships in a skirmish game.

[MarcusAurelius]

First of all, I'm really excited about this release. Secondly, what are the chances that WAS will allow us to build a fleet based on 2 aircraft carrier with planes and still stay under the 100 pt limit? It's just a thought, and maybe it wouldn't fare well, but it seems mighty cool.

Fielding two Enterprise carriers (think of the second as one of her sister ships, either Yorktown or Hornet) would take up 50 points.

That leaves you another 50 points for fighters, dive bombers and torpedo bombers. I think it's possible that early-war carrier aircraft will be costed at 10 points or less. This is based solely on what we know about the Atlanta. It was equipped with 16 5-inch guns, 9 1.1-inch guns and 8 torpedo tubes. That's a lot of firepower for 12 points.

While a squadron of F4F Wildcats may offer similar AA capability, it won't be as effective against ships and will probably have lower overall attack and defense values. In other words, it's a more limited unit — and should be costed accordingly.

Of course, this is only an educated guess. We won't know for sure until we see stats for aircraft.

[shadowhooch]

I wonder if the planes will be costed and operate like A&A the boardgame.

In other words they will be "relatively" costed cheaply compared to the ships. And if your carriers sink, you can't count the planes as surviving units as they must be scuttled in the sea.

That seems realistic. Planes are great; but the achilles heel is if they lose their carrier to land.

[CruorVult]

Fielding two Enterprise carriers (think of the second as one of her sister ships, either Yorktown or Hornet) would take up 50 points.

That leaves you another 50 points for fighters, dive bombers and torpedo bombers. I think it's possible that early-war carrier aircraft will be costed at 10 points or less. This is based solely on what we know about the Atlanta. It was equipped with 16 5-inch guns, 9 1.1-inch guns and 8 torpedo tubes. That's a lot of firepower for 12 points.

While a squadron of F4F Wildcats may offer similar AA capability, it won't be as effective against ships and will probably have lower overall attack and defense values. In other words, it's a more limited unit — and should be costed accordingly.

Of course, this is only an educated guess. We won't know for sure until we see stats for aircraft.

but the atlanta can only use its anti-aircraft fire at short range, while the wildcats can range out, along with anti-ship and other aircraft, presumably farther than gun range

[Muenchausen]

On the fifth of March, we'll get the rules and there is a section for advanced fleet play. I hope the limits will only be the amount of minis one owns, if not I will simply ignore their point limit. I'm looking forward to large naval battles. Although it looks pretty dim for recreating any historical battles at this point, After set II the potential should increase. In the mean time, I'll be more than happy to fight fictitious battles.

[SpeshulK111]

Yeah, that is what I was thinking. 2 Enterprises. Each can field 3 planes, or at least, I think so. I mean, I know the imbalance. But think of the =O you'd get as you place 2 enterprises and a few squads of torpedo bombers stare down his undefend Battleship =D. Or not....

[Muenchausen]

Sound like it might be pretty interesting to see what happens. I might give it a try when I get my minis.

[Diamondback]

Pointswise, that's where the CVL's shine. CVL plus full-size CV = enough fighters to keep the aircraft off both carriers, from one's air wing.

Battleship threat? Hit 'em first by air and hit 'em hard, then hope you've dealt enough damage to slow 'em down while the CV's retreat to open up distance and the escort DD's and cruisers form a battle-line to buy time for the next airstrike to prep.

Re A/C loss when carrier sinks, most carriers actually operated at less than full capacity, so they had some room to accommodate stranded planes, (I'd house-rule an "overload" of 1, turning the flight-deck into an open-air plane-park, which was done under some conditions.)

Also, I'd say there should be some mechanic to capture islands and build airstrips on; as long as you have one of those or a CV in play, your planes can stay in the game. HHR, anyone?

[XAos]

We don't yet have the rules for what carrier capacity does.
And it should be clear that some planes neither need (Catalina) nor have (Ju-87) a carrier. So I think we need to see either complete rules or a few more stats cards. It's possible that the Catalina, etc may say something like;
"Landbased: This aircraft can be used without including a carrier in your fleet."
Until we see at least one aircraft stats card. We are just guessing on how carrier fleets should be designed.
Based on other CMGs that have 100 point forces as standard. The cheapest units in the game will be about 3 points. And the cheapest units in WaS will either be aircraft or MTBs. So my guess is that most aircraft will be in the 3-5 point range. The uncommon aircraft might go as high as 10-12 points each.

[Joisey]

Pointswise, that's where the CVL's shine. CVL plus full-size CV = enough fighters to keep the aircraft off both carriers, from one's air wing.

Battleship threat? Hit 'em first by air and hit 'em hard, then hope you've dealt enough damage to slow 'em down while the CV's retreat to open up distance and the escort DD's and cruisers form a battle-line to buy time for the next airstrike to prep.

Re A/C loss when carrier sinks, most carriers actually operated at less than full capacity, so they had some room to accommodate stranded planes, (I'd house-rule an "overload" of 1, turning the flight-deck into an open-air plane-park, which was done under some conditions.)

Also, I'd say there should be some mechanic to capture islands and build airstrips on; as long as you have one of those or a CV in play, your planes can stay in the game. HHR, anyone?

Good strategy, but I'm already concerned that artificially small maps with artificial 'walls' isn't going to be a satisfying arena for carrier ops. A carrier group just shouldn't have to be worried about being "cornered" by a battleship fleet.

HHR? I'm not prepared to say that the stat cards need any revision until the full rules are known. But I do already think that the need for an "Advanced Rule Committee", which will add "free floating" maps of empty sea and Fog of War rules, may be necessary.

[hornet69]

First of all, I'm really excited about this release. Secondly, what are the chances that WAS will allow us to build a fleet based on 2 aircraft carrier with planes and still stay under the 100 pt limit? It's just a thought, and maybe it wouldn't fare well, but it seems mighty cool.
hey you can always do your own point game .i know i will 4 aircraft carriers for japan ...three for the us .midway scenario here we go. :D

[Autarch]

Don't forget the fourth US "carrier": Midway itself.

[kaz]

First of all, I'm really excited about this release. Secondly, what are the chances that WAS will allow us to build a fleet based on 2 aircraft carrier with planes and still stay under the 100 pt limit? It's just a thought, and maybe it wouldn't fare well, but it seems mighty cool.

Well me and joisey are playing a game over a thredand im useing a carier fleet IJN so you could take a look at this have in said this in a 100 point bild you leave your self open 2 subs

[Xocoyol]

Well, thrown in a few kates and it might work with a bit of luck.

[afilter]

Point Limits...we don't need no stinking point limits.

Actually I cannot remember the last 100 pt game I played. Majority of ours are 150+. Just played a 600pt 6 player(2 teams 3 players on each team) scenario last week.

http://boards.avalonhill.com/showthread.php?t=19296

I look at the 100pt game as a good tutorial to intorduce the rules and get you going while you start collecting your minis. I have already moved on to trying to replicate large fleet actions using the WAS rule base as a good outline with my house variations.

[Andras]

Try this,
Ark Royal
Enterprise
1 Hurricane
1 Wildcat
1 SBD
1 Swordfish
2 TBDs

If you want some support ships
Ark Royal
Princeton
1 Hurricane
2 Swordfish
1 Wildcat
1 SBD
Javelin
Fletcher

[Bigblue2]

You could always try these US, all carrier forces.

25 Enterprise
13 Dauntless
09 Devastator
07 Wildcat
16 Princeton
13 Dauntless
07 Wildcat
07 Catalina
97 total points

25 Enterprise
26 Dauntless x2
07 Wildcat
10 St. Lo
09 Devastator
13 Dauntless
09 Devastator
99 total points