ETO Online Campaign: Blitzkrieg through Baltic Sates

[Drax Kramer]

I have a question about the blitz move German tanks made through Baltic States in order to engage Soviet forces in Belorussia.

Was there some change of rules for A&A:E recently? Was there some new optional rule introduced specifically for the ETO Online Campaign? Is there a place where all such rules are listed.

I mean, allowing tanks to blitz through enemy occupied territory provided that initial ratio is 2:1 looks interesting for use beyond Online Campaign.

[Slaynar]

Was wondering that also, because there was Russian forces there in the province that the Germans Blitzed through??

And what about the Leingrad fight??
Robert

[wilson2]

Was there some new optional rule introduced specifically for the ETO Online Campaign?
yes

Was there some change of rules for A&A:E recently?
no this is only for campaign

[boersma8]

Of course you could always try it as a houserule. When I get around to playing the Europe boardgame again, I'll sure give it a try! The rule must be be sth like this: When the attacker takes a territory, surviving tanks and aircraft may attack yet another. ( I suppose, as Central command pointed out, that the Germans have in fact won the battle for the Baltic states, but CC said not all battles ( incl. Leningrad) are going to be included to be fought out on the A&A miniatures boards.......). The advantage for the attacker is that he can take another territory while it's still weak ( before enemy non-combat movement and reinforcements) , the disadvantage is that it'll cost him (expensive) tanks and possibly planes, rather than cheap infantry. Moreover, he'll be very vulnerable to counterattack! ( no infantry to take the hits, assuming the infantry behind it ALL moved in the combat move phase and can therefore not move again in the non-combat phase....)

[Drax Kramer]

Is there a place where Central Command published the overall list of changes to the original A&A:E rules for Online Campaign?

[warspite]

Is there a place where Central Command published the overall list of changes to the original A&A:E rules for Online Campaign?

No, but in the ETO turn one description, there is a mention that The German Wehrmacht has attacked the Baltic States and by outnumbering the defending Russians by a ratio of more than 2 to 1 the German panzers slice through in classic blitzkrieg fashion

That in itself is a REALLY interesting variant, aside from the simultaneous movement they've developed. I think that would seriously alter the standard Russian infantry stack-German tank stack that dominates typical play. Local numerical superiority allowing for the upper hand, the Germans might be encouraged to build more volume of units, i.e. infantry, and not just stock up on armor for 4-5 turns. Furthermore, if the pinning/breakthrough force doesn't win its battle, the blitzing exploitation force can't retreat (exc. aircraft, as usual).

[boersma8]

No, but in the ETO turn one description, there is a mention that

That in itself is a REALLY interesting variant, aside from the simultaneous movement they've developed. I think that would seriously alter the standard Russian infantry stack-German tank stack that dominates typical play. Local numerical superiority allowing for the upper hand, the Germans might be encouraged to build more volume of units, i.e. infantry, and not just stock up on armor for 4-5 turns. Furthermore, if the pinning/breakthrough force doesn't win its battle, the blitzing exploitation force can't retreat (exc. aircraft, as usual).

I'd like to see an added rule to the effect that tanks and aircraft ( fighters) can be paired up like infantry and artillery, making the tanks hit on a 4. Also attacking aircraft would hit on a four if there are no enemy fighters present in the territory. Finally, I also advocate air to air combat prior to ground combat. One round of combat. Optional retreat for both players ( air only), no retreat is another round of air-to-air etc. After which the ground battle would take place ( e.g. defender has no aircraft left after two rounds of air-to-air, remaining attacking aircraft, say two, are paired up with two attacking tanks all hitting on a 4 or lower..........

[Slaynar]

MAN you said a mouth full Boersma8
I Know alot of you who post here are real "crazed" military game enthuisast, but it bothers me why some people always want to change this game into one of the "rules" heavy games which are already out there. I love the fast play and ease of understanding THESE games provide. I dont have to wade through volumes of books and rules to understand how to play. I thanck the folks at Wizards of the Coast / Avalon Hill for thier work on bringing a militart type game down to the level of the casual player. I have played military games for ages, Board, card, and miniture... I have labored months painting all the litttle figures from ancients to modern day. I have worked hours with stacks of 1/2" cardboard chits to set up a battle, only to have my pet jump on the table and mix the chits up again.... As a store owner I have sold all of those type games and spent lots of time talking about them and explaining the rules to customers..... So Please Belive me when I say THIS game (WAS AAM) Is a God send to the gaming industry!!!! It also is easy enough to get young people involved in playing, and from my experience, it has broadened thier interest in History and the world... I have about 8 11-14 year old boys playing this and they actually go out and research the units, and equipment... and share what they have learned at our sessions.

So please guys take some of this into account when you give advise on "changeing" this game... I you need a rules heavy game... there are others out there... Lets leave this as easy as we can get it....

Robert
President Game Quest, Inc

[warspite]

Slaynar, I think most of the discussion on this thread is about the Axis & Allies: Europe board game, not the miniatures game. That said, I think the relatively minor rule change for breakthrough blitzing is a good, fun and historically accurate idea that would make the BOARD game have much more replay value. I'm in agreement that the relative simplicity of AAM/WaS has its appeal; I've collected a good amount myself, and I play with players who don't want anything more complicated, either.

One of these days I'm going to pull out World in Flames again, and I have one guy interested in setting up the Panzer Leader macro game, but until then, I'm having fun with these. My one complaint about A&A:E (board game) is the lack of authentic blitz and encirclement maneuvers, and this online rule makes for a very interesting variant, as I posted earlier.

[Slaynar]

/Shudders like someone walking across his grave....

Sorry But World in Flames and Panzer Leader bring back memories....

Robert

[warspite]

/Shudders like someone walking across his grave....

Sorry But World in Flames and Panzer Leader bring back memories....

Robert

Good ones or bad ones? ;)

[Slaynar]

LOL....

/Shudder
should explain..... HEHE
Robert

[dracos42]

MAN you said a mouth full Boersma8

Robert
President Game Quest, Inc

Robert,
Where is your store located? I travel to Virginia on occasion. My sister lives in northern Virginia, and I have friends in Richmond and Hampton Roads.

Michael

[boersma8]

MAN you said a mouth full Boersma8
I Know alot of you who post here are real "crazed" military game enthuisast, but it bothers me why some people always want to change this game into one of the "rules" heavy games which are already out there. I love the fast play and ease of understanding THESE games provide. I dont have to wade through volumes of books and rules to understand how to play. I thanck the folks at Wizards of the Coast / Avalon Hill for thier work on bringing a militart type game down to the level of the casual player. I have played military games for ages, Board, card, and miniture... I have labored months painting all the litttle figures from ancients to modern day. I have worked hours with stacks of 1/2" cardboard chits to set up a battle, only to have my pet jump on the table and mix the chits up again.... As a store owner I have sold all of those type games and spent lots of time talking about them and explaining the rules to customers..... So Please Belive me when I say THIS game (WAS AAM) Is a God send to the gaming industry!!!! It also is easy enough to get young people involved in playing, and from my experience, it has broadened thier interest in History and the world... I have about 8 11-14 year old boys playing this and they actually go out and research the units, and equipment... and share what they have learned at our sessions.

So please guys take some of this into account when you give advise on "changeing" this game... I you need a rules heavy game... there are others out there... Lets leave this as easy as we can get it....

Robert
President Game Quest, Inc

First of all, ofcourse you are perfectly entitled to like the game as is. I mean, so do I, otherwise I wouldn't be on these forums ;)

Secondly, I don't think the added ( optional) rule I suggested would be all that "difficult". Furthermore, it would add a lot of realism ( fleets without carriers and aircraft would be very vulnerable as they indeed were in WW 2 and from then on and in land battles a well executed team-up of airfcraft and tanks also proved lethal ( Blitzkrieg!). No invasion was ever launched without AIR superiority AFAIK. I miss that in the A&A we know, but that may be personal....


Finally, I'd like to own a more realistic game WITH miniatures ( I know there's e.g. "world at war", but the components are notably worse than in A&A and I miss terrain and weather influences and there's also "Struggle for Europe and Asia" which seems to be all I've ever wanted, but the price-tag is a bit too hefty for me.....). I think in addition to the already existing A&A games, a version with Italy added, weather and terrain features ( woods, mountains, marsh, rivers etc.) and some more historical and deeper rules would sell well! I suppose it could be a lot cheaper still than "Struggle" ( around $1000).