Gen-Con 2007 AAM Preview Photos

[Pasalades]

I am surprised that no one has posted any photos yet of the minis at Gencon so I thought I would do the honors myself. I got a nice shot of all three of them, the ones I did of the individual minis did not turn out so well.

Notice that with the new size is the most notable change is in the width of the minis, especially from this angle. This didn't quite pick up on the photos we saw of the T-34/76 earlier (which from this angle looks very different from its predecessor). There are details on each that show that the models are definitively different.

I strongly disagree with Cruizin2000s statement that the vehicles are out of scale with each other. The size ratios match up well and the photo shows this. Also, I'm not sure if you can quite see it, but the barrels look as if they are fixed. No moving them up and down on these newer ones. I actually got an explanation as to why. This should prevent problems with barrel gaps on minis like the Rhino and the Centurion at the cost of moving said barrels up and down. If it makes them -LOOK- better than I am all for it. Anyway, hope you enjoy the pic.

[Lynx7725]

The new Sherman still looks way too glossy. They really shouldn't skim on that particular tank.

At any rate, I'm not terribly impressed with the thought of bigger units. I personally prefer smaller and more detailed myself, storage space being a real consideration for me.

[J.L.Robert]

Also, I'm not sure if you can quite see it, but the barrels look as if they are fixed. No moving them up and down on these newer ones. I actually got an explanation as to why. This should prevent problems with barrel gaps on minis like the Rhino and the Centurion at the cost of moving said barrels up and down. If it makes them -LOOK- better than I am all for it. Anyway, hope you enjoy the pic.

Elevating gun barrels were cute, but unnecessary. If this move improves the quality of detail, that's fine.

[NorthernRommel]

Thanks for posting those palasades...

A few better close ups would be appreciated.

Those three basic tanks look like they can still be usuable with the regular two inch maps, but the turret on the German PIV looks wrong. Could just be the angle and picture - hard to be sure.

[Lotus]

Hey Pasalades,

Thanks much for posting the pics. Nice to get some visuals so we could all see for ourselves. Word of mouth...or rant as the case may be, didn't quite do the trick for me.

I like the look of the new PZIV much better. Surprised the Sherman ratios don't seem so drastic...but it is still bigger, that's plain.

I see what NorthernRommel means about using them on 2" hexes. I think that won't be the case with the KT though.

And as far as the fixed barrels go, some of us will mod them to elevate w/o the gaps. ;)

[OIFvet]

Pasalades, thanks for the pictures! :)

[panzerpainter]

If this is the only difference (perhaps slightly longer and a bit more on the width department) I certainly dont see much too merit the "mass defections" as have been discussed.

[Uncle_Joe]

If this is the only difference (perhaps slightly longer and a bit more on the width department) I certainly dont see much too merit the "mass defections" as have been discussed.

Yeah, as I said when this all first blew up I seriously doubt most of these 'OMG! I'M QUITTING' folks will actually leave.

Having been here for almost two years, I've seen countless people get 'fed up' over various issues and many are still here. True, many people have left, but the game has been out for a few years now and people do tend to move on to the newer things.

Amusingly, the WaS forum is now getting the 'OMG! I QUIT!!!' treatment due to the announcement of Set2 and the 'reprints' that it will contain. But just as for here, I doubt most of them will actually leave and probably half of those 'quitters' will still have booster boxes pre-ordered when the new set comes out.

I think the only way you can tell for sure when someone 'quits' is when they simply dont post anymore. The ones that make the big production about it obviously still want to enjoy the game and they will likely eventually talk themselves back into playing (or into staying).

Unfortunately, WotC knows all this too. So they can/will continue to make (unpopular?) changes to their games because they know that in the end, they have a group of people who will buy it.

For me, the death knell would be if they radically change the game(s) enough such that my old investment is no longer really usable. So far, I havent seen anything to the effect that that is happening (despite early indications that that might have been the case). If it does, there wont be any big production from me...I'll just stop frequenting the board and my playing time will drift to other games.

[Jesse_James]

Elevating gun barrels were cute, but unnecessary. If this move improves the quality of detail, that's fine.

If this is true, I think it because the other big WWII miniature Market (FoW) doe not have movable barrels. You measure from the barrel when firing, so I think that was a motive from Wizards. Hard to measure when your barrel is flopping. I think there biggest issue would be bent barrels.

or my other conspiracy theory is that making movable part is not all that cheap, they would need to make a second mold for movable barrels. This would cut down on the cost of production. From what dozens have told me, molds are very, very, expensive.

[Cruizin2000]

I am surprised that no one has posted any photos yet of the minis at Gencon so I thought I would do the honors myself. I got a nice shot of all three of them, the ones I did of the individual minis did not turn out so well.

Notice that with the new size is the most notable change is in the width of the minis, especially from this angle. This didn't quite pick up on the photos we saw of the T-34/76 earlier (which from this angle looks very different from its predecessor). There are details on each that show that the models are definitively different.

I strongly disagree with Cruizin2000s statement that the vehicles are out of scale with each other. The size ratios match up well and the photo shows this. Also, I'm not sure if you can quite see it, but the barrels look as if they are fixed. No moving them up and down on these newer ones. I actually got an explanation as to why. This should prevent problems with barrel gaps on minis like the Rhino and the Centurion at the cost of moving said barrels up and down. If it makes them -LOOK- better than I am all for it. Anyway, hope you enjoy the pic.


Did you get a chance to take a ruler to them to compare the size to their actual counterpart?;) Remember, 15mm = 6'.

C2000

[Lotus]

Incidentally, what map are those tanks sitting on?

Off topic I know, but it is a desert map. Just curious.

[Pasalades]

Did you get a chance to take a ruler to them to compare the size to their actual counterpart?;) Remember, 15mm = 6'.

C2000

Well rulers don't do much good with them under glass, but I know how the scale goes (I have FoW for reference... should have brought them to take pictures with them) and it is my opinion that they are scaled fine. May I ask did you get a chance to ruler them yourself? That might help my rather inconsistent sight.

[Ubergeek]

Thanks for posting the photos of comparison. It's truly sad that they had to be posted by a fan here in the community threads and not on the front Hasbro/AH webpage by the company that promotes and sells them.

But after seeing them I can see why. There's nothing indicating a spectacular improvement in detail other than size. I guess if you increased the scale to 1:1 you could say "wow, this new scale is really detailed just like the real thing". But for now, I've got 1/144 minis that are more detailed than what's provided with v2.0. Maybe it's the photo but the new ratios side by side don't look any different than the old ones other than being bigger. Plus, the paint jobs certainly don't look like a marked improvement either.

As for quitting the game, I'll probably buy the N. Africa set units when they come out in December just because there will probably be a lot of the ones I've been wanting to see made (like trucks). I'll just live with the scale differences. But as far as set 6 goes, I'll just get a starter for the other two maps and be happy with all the units I currently have from v1.0. I'll just change my cards to reflect any new point costs. There's no sense in getting new units that are the same, only bigger. I'm one of the players disgruntled with the scale change, and Hasbro can go choke on set 6 and the new scale. I'm also in the gloom and doom camp that says the game will be discontinued after the N. Africa set (which will see the shelves only because it's already been cast). I'm happy with my current investment and will continue to get more of the v1.0 as they get discounted by retailers.

[Cruizin2000]

Well rulers don't do much good with them under glass, but I know how the scale goes (I have FoW for reference... should have brought them to take pictures with them) and it is my opinion that they are scaled fine. May I ask did you get a chance to ruler them yourself? That might help my rather inconsistent sight.

Actually, I did.:cool: That little short dark-haired lady with the glasses let me touch them and then I whipped out the old ruler and measured them. If I get talked into buying into Set I/2.0, I want to see if all of the "truth" is there. So yes, they are out of scale with each other - just like 1.0 was. I really should've wrote down what their actual sizes were but it was a quickie hit and run as she didn't want to get into trouble or have others wanting to touch things. Consistant inconsistancies but in a bigger scale. They should've just left the scale the was it was and fix about 6 pieces - long life for A&AM.

C2000

[J.L.Robert]

Did you get a chance to take a ruler to them to compare the size to their actual counterpart?;) Remember, 15mm = 6'.

C2000

Actually, I remember the mm scale being the equivalent of a full-grown individual. 15mm should be closer to 5 feet, 6 inches than 6 feet, and the vehicles should not be quite as large as you are expecting them to be.

Depending on what 15mm is equivalent to, the model scale would be:

(15mm = 5' 0") = 1:100 scale
(15mm = 5' 4") = 1:108 scale
(15mm = 5' 6") = 1:112 scale
(15mm = 6' 0") = 1:122 scale

[RangerDane]

Great Photo!

Thanks!

What else are they saying about WAS?

[panzerpainter]

Yeah, as I said when this all first blew up I seriously doubt most of these 'OMG! I'M QUITTING' folks will actually leave.

Having been here for almost two years, I've seen countless people get 'fed up' over various issues and many are still here. True, many people have left, but the game has been out for a few years now and people do tend to move on to the newer things.

Amusingly, the WaS forum is now getting the 'OMG! I QUIT!!!' treatment due to the announcement of Set2 and the 'reprints' that it will contain. But just as for here, I doubt most of them will actually leave and probably half of those 'quitters' will still have booster boxes pre-ordered when the new set comes out.

I think the only way you can tell for sure when someone 'quits' is when they simply dont post anymore. The ones that make the big production about it obviously still want to enjoy the game and they will likely eventually talk themselves back into playing (or into staying).

Unfortunately, WotC knows all this too. So they can/will continue to make (unpopular?) changes to their games because they know that in the end, they have a group of people who will buy it.

For me, the death knell would be if they radically change the game(s) enough such that my old investment is no longer really usable. So far, I havent seen anything to the effect that that is happening (despite early indications that that might have been the case). If it does, there wont be any big production from me...I'll just stop frequenting the board and my playing time will drift to other games.

Agreed. They would have to do something like what they did to "Mage Knights" to really kill the game. That was MY introduction to Wizards of the Coast, and THAT one still leaves a bitter taste in my mouth. I also agrre with you about people just naturally drifting to some other "new " game. That happens to the best of games.

[panzerpainter]

Thanks for posting the photos of comparison. It's truly sad that they had to be posted by a fan here in the community threads and not on the front Hasbro/AH webpage by the company that promotes and sells them.
THUD
.
.
.
.
the sound of a nail being hit on the head.
.
.
.
I think the PzIV was a total unknown to all of us, until this pic posted by a player, and not WoTC. Maybe they just like us so much that they wanted to surprise us????
As far as the paint jobs being no better than before .... thats good for me. I still get to sell re-paints :)

[general hoth]

thanks for the pictures!:) good idea;

[Uncle_Joe]

They would have to do something like what they did to "Mage Knights" to really kill the game. That was MY introduction to Wizards of the Coast, and THAT one still leaves a bitter taste in my mouth.

That wasnt WotC...that was WizKids. And that has to go down in history as one of THE dumbest gaming marketing ideas in a long time....

[horacus]

If this is the only difference (perhaps slightly longer and a bit more on the width department) I certainly dont see much too merit the "mass defections" as have been discussed.

Agree here. It is still, even if a little weard...play with both, present and past units.

[Richter von Manthofen]

See the other thread with the Tiger I - that one really improved (stat wise and paintjob wise)

We now know of 9/60 of all units (not counting the ones on the booster) - following is the FULL? list

T-34/76 - (28) - u
T34/85 - ?? - r
T-70 - 12 - u

Cromwell IV - ?? - r
SMLE No. 4 Rifle - 3 - c

Bazooka - ?? - c
M1 Garand - ?? - c
M26 Pershing - ?? - r
M4A1 Sherman - (21) - u
M5 Halftrack - ?? - u
Red Devil Captain - ?? - u

Mauser Kar 98k - ?? - c
MG42 - 10 - u
Panzer III Ausf. ? - ?? - u
Panzer IV Ausf. G - 22 - u
Panzerfaust 30 - ?? - c
Stug III? - ?? - - u
Tiger I - 56! - r

Type89 Mortar - 9 - c

[FlyingDutchman]

Elevating gun barrels were cute, but unnecessary. If this move improves the quality of detail, that's fine.

I really do not like fixed guns - Indeed this the only reason I do not have a comet. I think it really does not look good with a fixed gun but more importantly - fixed guns break more easily when piling your models...

Anyway, I will not go with the new scale so this is not my problem :p

[FlyingDutchman]

I'm happy with my current investment and will continue to get more of the v1.0 as they get discounted by retailers.

Same here - as I have to rely on the existing units and Hauler 1:120 models, I jsut bought another 3 cases of sets 1 and 2 so that I can start thinking about converting ;)

[FlyingDutchman]

We now know of 9/60 of all units (not counting the ones on the booster) - following is the FULL? list

T

If WotC were smart (which I am beginning to doubt) they would include the Nashorn, Brumbar and Hellcat just to prove that the first set of version 2 of the game is se3ize consistent;) Strange indeed that they shy away from the old problem areas...:confused:

[NorthernRommel]

Well stuff is selling for rock bottom prices around these parts, except on here of course. Some guys are happy to get a buck a piece for rares.

Its sad actually. But at least it allows for expanding the collections of those of us who will stick with 1.0 minis.

[SunningTurtle]

Wow!

If Rares are selling North of the Border for $1 Each , then sigh me up!!

I need at least 2 of EVERYTHING! :D

Heck, I would pay $1.50 for them. Why even $2.00 for T-34/76s! :p

I guess the US Dollar has a much better exchange rate? ;)


Good Hunting!

Sunning Turtle

[DocD]

Haven't seen the price drop in my area....still running $14.00 a booster for AAM1.0.

Nice pics, thanks for posting.

The picture does make the scale change look tolerable, but I know how different a picture of something can look from the real deal. If I may speak for some of the "quitters", I think most of us are going to be buying single stuff we want or need that will complete the game. If that gets the bottom line for Wotc into the black, all good for them, but I personally won't be buying sets this go around.

[oddfellow]

If you will pardon the opinion of someone who 'quit the game'
{I actually had the game quit me, as I can't PAY anyone to play around here...} it appears that they just dialed the CAC machine up 15% on the existing masters. {I have no actual proof of this, just a hunch.}


Check out these pics: looks like the models are slightly different. Pay special attention to the items on the fronts of the tanks, esp the T-34. The sides (stowage?) of the panzer also looks to be different, which would contradict your theory that they just upsized the existing masters.

http://boards.avalonhill.com/showthread.php?t=22563

[oddfellow]

Incidentally, what map are those tanks sitting on?

Off topic I know, but it is a desert map. Just curious.

Pretty sure its one of the D&D minis maps.

[horacus]

Yes, the map is D&D miniatures map.

[polish_horsy]

are they really fixed barrels and pegs for the turrets?

[Cruizin2000]

Check out these pics: looks like the models are slightly different. Pay special attention to the items on the fronts of the tanks, esp the T-34. The sides (stowage?) of the panzer also looks to be different, which would contradict your theory that they just upsized the existing masters.

http://boards.avalonhill.com/showthread.php?t=22563

Take one of your base set Shermans and look at it through a magnifying glass - same thing but only bigger. The only difference in the Pnzr is how the gun fits in the turret which looks to be better. Other than that, SOS, different scale.

C2000

[Cruizin2000]

Actually, I remember the mm scale being the equivalent of a full-grown individual. 15mm should be closer to 5 feet, 6 inches than 6 feet, and the vehicles should not be quite as large as you are expecting them to be.

Depending on what 15mm is equivalent to, the model scale would be:

(15mm = 5' 0") = 1:100 scale
(15mm = 5' 4") = 1:108 scale
(15mm = 5' 6") = 1:112 scale
(15mm = 6' 0") = 1:122 scale

I'm a toy soldier collector and when it comes to the scale of a man they go by 6' per man. For instance a 1/32 scale fig is 2 1/2" tall and also considered 54mm. Or a 1/72 scale soldier is 1" tall or 25mm. There's 72 inches in 6 foot.

For laughs, measure your SNLF Capt. He's 6' in 15mm. The SE Capt is 7':eek: .

Alot of the earlier A&A tanks are pretty close to 15mm believe it or not. The Panther D, King Tiger, Pnzr III, Pnzr II to name a few. I did a comparison based on the game piece and the real life counterpart based in length, overall length, width, and height. They are all pretty close.

C2000

[panzerpainter]

What in the world are you upset over? You claim rares are going for $1 where you are, and someone states they would love to get rares for that price, as many as they can get. Perhaps you were exhaggerating? Dont get mad at a guy cause YOU tell what the going rate for something is where you are, and he wants some of the action. Thats like my grocery store offering free samples then getting mad cause someone wants a taste. Sheesh.
Just a thought:

If you're going to use my country as a cheap marketplace, then stay out. We don't want people like that here.

[NorthernRommel]

How is that ironic?

[pointless bit on NAFTA cut]

The race to the bottom on minis prices started up here in places about five months ago. People who had collections mostly dumped them already. Rares go from 50 cents to $2.00, with only a few die hards still trying to get the old $5 to $10 range. Incidently I have a lot of IS2 if someone has Crocs, Elephants, or KVs to trade. I dont need the cards, just the minis.

Now back to the thread.....the natives want more photos !!! Surely someone got some better close up views

[Volorkey]

As I said previously the scale changes are not THAT drastic I have no problem with them, I don't even see that much of a problem of fielding old and new minis at the same time. But that's just me. as for no more elevating barrels, *shrugs* I can live without them.

[well_it_sounded_nice]

scale change is insignificant if you had an old and new t34 on different sides of the map you wouldnt notice

[oddfellow]

Take one of your base set Shermans and look at it through a magnifying glass - same thing but only bigger. The only difference in the Pnzr is how the gun fits in the turret which looks to be better. Other than that, SOS, different scale.

C2000


I definitely see a difference in the panzer and T-34, its subtle but there in the picture I'm referencing from GenCon.

T34
Front left: old has two small items/ new has one larger item
Front right: old has square & 2 circular items/ new has 1 larger square item

panzer looks to have 3 stowage items vs old model.

[Neon Knight]

Incidentally, what map are those tanks sitting on?

Off topic I know, but it is a desert map. Just curious.

The map is the Blue Dragon Lair map for Dungeons and Dragon's Minis (or half of it at least).

[Grenzewolf]

scale change is insignificant if you had an old and new t34 on different sides of the map you wouldnt notice

For some (myself included) the scale difference is very significant. It is a matter of asthetics, continuity and how an individual preceives the gameing experience. The folks that jeered when complaints were issued over the "Hell Cat", M-3, Hamburglermobile, ect of course will not have issue with like vehicles being different. These are some of the same folks that said the Spitfire and the ME-109 differences were too insignificant to warrant a different mini.

I suppose if you treated each peice as one does with the A&A board game (Or Monapoly... Who ever complained the boot was not to scale with the race car? :rolleyes: ) it is insignificant. If you have a relativly small collection (I.E your favorite stacked 100pt army) then yes, "Whats the big Deal"?. This would be the majority of group dynamic remaining on the forum today. For big historical game play collectors like myself though its realy depressing. Most of us couldnt even bare to field the drasticly over or undersized units (the hard core still claim there is no AAM Spitfire). This is something that cannot be easily explained or understood by someone whose approach to the gameing experience differs.

You will also find that the folks that consistantly respond with "Come On! It's only a game!" have no issue with scale or accuracey. True enough it is a "GAME" just as a Harley is only a motorcycle, a Mercedes is only a car, or a Bayliner is only a boat. "It's only a Game" should Only apply to interaction between players as reference to: not being a life and death struggle worth getting upset over losing and good sportsmanship. Who on earth thinks this is a clever reply to comments on quality and accuracy where large sums of money are expended. When we started this (Lottery) Collectable miniatures game, there were certain expectations. Esentialy it was similar to buying a motorcycle or boat one accessory at a time. Just because its a pleasure item doesnt mean you forego quality. If the parts dont fit or match it makes the whole ensamble look bad. If you stop it will never be quite complete. Soooo you finaly get the new hood for your car. Its not the same color, its too big and hangs over the fenders but hey, it still goes up and down. "Quit complaining its only a car!".;) Oh and by the way.... were repainting the same hood and issueing it next month as the trunk! Whats the difference?......Sucker!:D Thankfully the large majority of the parts of the GAME do fit and look good. Which is why I have always and will continue to support and promote this GAME. That said my investment gives me the right to be disgruntled with aspects that are not on par with expectations so as not to condone further indiscrestion by Hasbro.

So to end on somewhat of a positive note... I have a massive collection of miniatures that I have had countless hours of gameing enjoyment and that will continue. Sadly my collecting is all but over. Luckily I have slews of rares that represent entire companies so I will never need (or desire) to mix beta with 2.0. I will miss most of all the anticipation of new releases but from what Ive seen the majority appears to be rereleases in scale. Though I am depressed about my situation I do like the concept of broad spectrum scaleling for all minis but I'm to deeply invested to shift. I'll be relegated to buying singles of individual miniatures or consigning Panzerpainter for Beta Scale of new vehicles. It's all 3 years to late for me but new players are going to have an excellent and resonably to scale game with fewer bugs if it survives.

[polish_horsy]

For some (myself included) the scale difference is very significant. It is a matter of asthetics, continuity and how an individual preceives the gameing experience. The folks that jeered when complaints were issued over the "Hell Cat", M-3, Hamburglermobile, ect of course will not have issue with like vehicles being different. These are some of the same folks that said the Spitfire and the ME-109 differences were too insignificant to warrant a different mini.

I suppose if you treated each peice as one does with the A&A board game (Or Monapoly... Who ever complained the boot was not to scale with the race car? :rolleyes: ) it is insignificant. If you have a relativly small collection (I.E your favorite stacked 100pt army) then yes, "Whats the big Deal"?. This would be the majority of group dynamic remaining on the forum today. For big historical game play collectors like myself though its realy depressing. Most of us couldnt even bare to field the drasticly over or undersized units (the hard core still claim there is no AAM Spitfire). This is something that cannot be easily explained or understood by someone who whose approach to the gameing experience differs.

You will also find that the folks that consistantly respond with "Come On! It's only a game!" have no issue with scale or accuracey. True enough it is a "GAME" just as a Harley is only a motorcycle, a Mercedes is only a car, or a Bayliner is only a boat. "It's only a Game" Only applies to interaction between players as reference to: not being a life and death struggle worth getting upset over losing and good sportsmanship. Who on earth thinks this is a clever reply to comments on quality and accuracy where large sums of money are expended. When we started this (Lottery) Collectable miniatures game, there were certain expectations. Esentialy it was similar to buying a motorcycle or boat one accessory at a time. If the parts dont fit or match it makes the whole ensamble look bad but if you stop it's never quite complete. Soooo you finaly get the new hood for your car. Its not the same color, its too big and hangs over the fenders but hey, it still goes up and down. "Quit complaining its only a car!".;) Oh and by the way.... were repainting the same hood and issueing it next month as the trunk! Whats the difference?......Sucker!:D Thankfully the large majority of the parts of the GAME do fit and look good.

So to end on somewhat of a positive note... I have a massive collection of miniatures that I have had countless hours of gameing enjoyment and that will continue. Sadly my collecting is all but over. Luckily I have slews of rares that represent entire companies so I will never need (or desire) to mix beta with 2.0. I will miss most of all the anticipation of new releases but from what Ive seen the majority appears to be rereleases in scale. Though I am depressed about my situation I do like the concept of broad spectrum scaleling for all minis but I'm to deeply invested to shift. I'll be relegated to buying singles of individual miniatures or consigning Panzerpainter for Beta's of new vehicles. It's all 3 years to late for me but new players are going to have an excellent and resonably to scale game with few bugs if it survives.

Can I just quote him and say "same here". OK I will. Well said. Unfortunatly.

[TomServo]

Nice post Grenzewolf. I guess I'll just have to say "same here" too, as you've pretty much summed up my feelings.

[oddfellow]

I think that I'd be happy to play with all my 1.0 stuff for a very long time. I can't get in enough games to exhaust all the build possibilities as it is, and even playing the same units on the same map will yield wildly differing results based on in-game events, so 1.0 still has a long healthy life for me if I choose that route.
Having said that, I'm excited that the AAM line continues. Part (half?) of the fun for me is the excitement of the booster & case pull and collecting aspect. If a movie costs $8.00 (here in MN at least) plus refreshments I'm looking at about $15.00 for 1 1/2 hours of entertainment. Opening a booster gives me at least that for a comparable price, but I'm the type who will kill an hour trying to create an army that makes good use of a UK PIAT, whether its a competitive build or not. I'm just not sure I'm ready to give up on the collecting aspect of the hobby and I think that I won't be able to make a decision on the new stuff until I get to handle a few of the tanks myself. I plan on picking up the starter and go from there. If I like what I see then I'll go all in with several starters and a few cases. I'll keep 1.0 pieces and maps for larger scale games and the bigger stuff for play on the new maps. I think that the new rules, pieces and maps are better and I'm willing to pay to have the best possible version of this game.

[NorthernRommel]

I will miss most of all the anticipation of new releases but from what Ive seen the majority appears to be rereleases in scale. Though I am depressed about my situation I do like the concept of broad spectrum scaleling for all minis but I'm to deeply invested to shift. I'll be relegated to buying singles of individual miniatures or consigning Panzerpainter for Beta Scale of new vehicles. It's all 3 years to late for me but new players are going to have an excellent and resonably to scale game with fewer bugs if it survives.

You mean you aren't anticipating new maps from me and Graphy, new rules, new unit stat cards, new ways to field a full battalion? Specific battle scenarios (historical of course) :rolleyes:

[Grenzewolf]

You mean you aren't anticipating new maps from me and Graphy, new rules, new unit stat cards, new ways to field a full battalion? Specific battle scenarios (historical of course) :rolleyes:

Why certainly I am;). I myself am writting yet another campaign this time featuring the the 2nd Russian Horse Cavalry division's exploits during Typhoon. (Research as you know is the most exhausting part).

The fact that many of us are all in the same boat over the scale change makes the independantefforts of folks that will still support original scale maps all the more important. Those that don't I shall call them SELL OUTS <grin>. LONG LIVE OLD SCHOOL AAM SCALEING (manly cause we dont have anyother choice:rolleyes: )

BTW, It seems to have fallen on deaf ears at AH but I and the rest of us still realy need old scale Winter Maps, Tiles for Factories & Airfields, and some means of makeing and publishing Decent looking Scenarios that does not require the use of a Data Base or uncommon (expesive) programs. If I had the time I would make something up in word, excel or paint that everyone could use.

[NorthernRommel]

Why certainly I am;).
I myself am writting yet another campaign this time featuring the the 2nd Russian Horse Cavalry division's exploits during Typhoon. (Research as you know is the most exhausting part).

BTW, It seems to have fallen on deaf ears at AH but I and the rest of us still realy need old scale Winter Maps, Tiles for Factories & Airfields, and some means of makeing and publishing Decent looking Scenarios that does not require the use of a Data Base or uncommon (expesive) programs. If I had the time I would make something up in word, excel or paint that everyone could use.

Well email me at opmgames@yahoo.com and let me know what winter maps and tiles you want. I do have some that I did for the Finland War. They just got put on the backburner due to the African and Alpine map sets. Your own project sounds interesting.

I'm not sure what your looking for Scenario wise. Do you means some kind of HTML template or something else?

[DocD]

Great post Gwolf. Always nice to know that my misery has company. :)

[Richter von Manthofen]

Same here!

VERS 1.0 was not perfect, but in a way it was our baby.

BTW I actually have a friend who builds a Porsche part by part ;) - He surely would NOT accept that we tell him its ONLY a car.

Maybe I am not that hardcore on scale/units, I like to field my messerspit, I consider sometimes the Hamburgermobile (against Chinese in early war); I even use the Hellcat, but I definitly don't want a T34 thats almost double size (speaking of volumen her) of the one (actually around 10 - lost exact count ;)) I already have...

[Grenzewolf]

Same here!

Maybe I am not that hardcore on scale/units, I like to field my messerspit, I consider sometimes the Hamburgermobile (against Chinese in early war); I even use the Hellcat, but I definitly don't want a T34 thats almost double size (speaking of volumen her) of the one (actually around 10 - lost exact count ;)) I already have...

RGR that. Like vehicles out of scale with each other just won't happen on my maps. You may as well just break our a bag of Army Men and Hot wheels and use them as proxis at that point.

[Muenchausen]

Gwolf, Without quoting everything you said, well said. Matches my sentiments exactly. Maybe we should elect you as our spokesman and send you to Hasbro for a little face to face dialog. ;)

[Photoner Hawkwind]

Thanks for the pics.

I will definately quit.....buying new product that looks as odd as that together. ;)

But I will keep on playing with the vehicles I have for many years to come.:D

[Photoner Hawkwind]

For some (myself included) the scale difference is very significant. It is a matter of asthetics, continuity and how an individual preceives the gameing experience.

You will also find that the folks that consistantly respond with "Come On! It's only a game!" have no issue with scale or accuracey. True enough it is a "GAME" just as a Harley is only a motorcycle, a Mercedes is only a car, or a Bayliner is only a boat. When we started this (Lottery) Collectable miniatures game, there were certain expectations. Esentialy it was similar to buying a motorcycle or boat one accessory at a time. Just because its a pleasure item doesnt mean you forego quality. If the parts dont fit or match it makes the whole ensamble look bad. If you stop it will never be quite complete. Soooo you finaly get the new hood for your car. Its not the same color, its too big and hangs over the fenders but hey, it still goes up and down. "Quit complaining its only a car!".;) Oh and by the way.... were repainting the same hood and issueing it next month as the trunk! Whats the difference?......Sucker!:D Thankfully the large majority of the parts of the GAME do fit and look good. Which is why I have always and will continue to support and promote this GAME. That said my investment gives me the right to be disgruntled with aspects that are not on par with expectations so as not to condone further indiscrestion by Hasbro.



I remember a Car company like this. I think it was called Yugo or something similar.:D

For anyone actually associated with this car company, I will apologise in advance. I was only kidding. The car company was better than the above example.