American Heavy Mortars: How can an Axis player effectively deal/compete with them???

[Elfy]

(specifically, in bigger point games (200+))

Typically, my Allied opponent puts up a battery (three or more)of US heavy mortars out of LOS in the far part of the battle map, uses a Red Devil Captain to gain it's pin pointer ability on his mortars, adds a Bofors (Plus 1 or 2 Lightnings or Spitfires) to guard the battery from planes, and has a Screaming Eagle Captain and a couple of Screaming Eagle Paratroopers in reserve to drop down and defend them. Of course, all of their troops/vehicles/airplanes (and each other) spot for the mortars (plus can move/fire, unlike a dedicated spotter (total crap!!)).

I've tried dropping Japanese paratroopers, but they always have to drop out of cover. My opponent drops in his far superior Screaming Eagle paratroopers and wipes them out before I can do much with them.

I've tried taking 3-4 Folke Wolf airplanes, but between the Bofors and Allied planes, my planes usually only get one or two passes (before being decimated) and typically all I manage to do is disrupt a couple of mortars because I either didn't roll well enough or my opponent made his cover saves for his units.

I’ve tried using fast vehicles against them, such as 222 armored cars or Ha-Go tanks, but met with little success either. Since everything US spots for the US heavy mortar, it's nearly impossible to get to the mortars with my fast vehicles without some of them being blow away in the dash towards them. Even if they get there, my opponent's mortars are typical in such a place that it's hard to shoot the mortars without coming into CA range of the Screaming Eagle paratroopers, which make short work of 2/2 vehicles.

I've tried running mostly armored vehicles, such as Elite Panzer IVs, but mortars can still destroy them as well, plus it's hard to beat many infantry with vehicles, especially towards turn 7 where the vehicles (because any infantry I brought has already been blown away by indirect mortar fire) have to occupy the objective and suffer CA attacks.

Are there any suggestions for other tactics to try?

I'm quite frustrated with those ridiculously under priced death-from-above US heavy mortars that can hide so far out of battle that it's nearly impossible to get anything on them while they can use any US unit to spot for them (even if the unit moves/fires that same assault phase!!!) =/

[johnnyonthespot]

Maybe try to advance a Brummbar or two along the edges of the map, keeping their rear (defense 4) to the edge so that it is tough for AT guns or tanks to stop them. Get within range and then blast the heck out of the mortars. Even if you lose a Brummbar, if you eliminate two mortars you come out on top points-wise.

Also, I wouldn't play a 200+ point game that has to be over by turn 7.

But yes, I agree. Improved Indirect Fire is a ridiculous SA.

[TheJudge]

It's sick actually. Planes calling in an airstrike is fine, makes perfect sense, as long as it's fair for everyone to do it. A true spotter should be required but right now, it isn't soooo......you can house rule it, you can figure out a way to beat it, the Brummbar is an excellent idea for that, but even better than a Brummbar is....2 Brummbars.

I think what is even worse is the 2 mortars, 2 3"guns, 2 heros, and 2 planes...talk about cheese on a stick...OMG

[ArmyVet]

I don't really play the Axis side ..... but, I wanted to say thanks for the tip about the heavy mortars!

I have been getting my butt kicked lately and this is gonna help me out alot!

[NorthernRommel]

Plus in reality most mortars were useless against armored vehicles. But then in AAM even a Vickers can take out most German tanks. But the reverse does not happen because even the lowly Stuart or Lee is invulnerable to german small infantry unit fire. Winning as allied is far too easy.

[johnnyonthespot]

If we're still talking about a 200+ point game...

Go with 1-2 Vet Tigers - they should be able to deal with those mortars (and just about anything else) with a +1 on every die roll. And it only has to be 10(?) hexes away with Extended Range. Sure, the cost is astronomically higher, but the Tiger has SA2 and is more versatile in what it can target successfully.

[CdtWeasel]

the motorcycle might come in handy.

[NEVjr]

Originally Posted by NorthernRommel

Plus in reality most mortars were useless against armored vehicles. But then in AAM even a Vickers can take out most German tanks. But the reverse does not happen because even the lowly Stuart or Lee is invulnerable to german small infantry unit fire. Winning as allied is far too easy.

not big ones, they would be dropping a pretty large mortar bomb on the top of the tank, 82mm is getting into the realm of serious artilary

[OtterSC]

maybe i am being over technical, but why wouldn't normal rules for standard mortars (the heavy ones) go up against back armor of vehicles? the top of a vehicle is thinner than the front. and i am not aware of mortars traveling more parallel to the ground. hmm.... i wonder.

anyway, i have not gone up against them. my opponent never really picks them. and i hope he doesn't use them in the future.

[Lotus]

A good indirect counter to the heavy mortar is the German sniper. Both are difficult to get at. Both do lots of damage against infantry. Each in their way seemed like a grossly broken piece to some at first. I'm fine w/ both.

Played the Amis in a 500-pt game last week and at the end of it I took out most of my opponent's infantry with the help of the heavy mortars while he cleaned out all but one of my tanks, leaving him w/ his Jagdtiger, King Tiger, and 2 Tiger Is. He won on points...lots of points.

So what I'm saying is that every piece has good combos for and against it. The Brummbar, motorcycles, Elite PZIVs, Stugs...these are units that immediately come to mind, as some stated earlier.

When the German Paratroopers arrive, they may have the distinct honor of not taking flak because other paratroopers broke the "broken" ground before them, hence few will likely complain about their usefulness. They will also certainly harrass the heavy mortars quite nicely.