Road bonus if you end on a road?

[Motdc]

I've always understood that you can get a road bonus even if you've expended all of your move points (you've got zero move "points" left), as long as you end on a road and then move along it 1 space.

But recent rulings do not seem consistant with what I believed, so I wanted to make sure I wasn't screwing anything else up either!

Thanks,
Mot

[Y2UAsk]

You're remembering correctly. What recent rulings seem to contradict that?

Steve

[Motdc]

You've made my day, I love discussion and analyzing the rules. Weird, I know!

On to business...

Allowing a vehicle with no move points left ending on a road to get the road bonus and then move along it 1 space seems to be the opposite of this (emphasis added):

The road bonus allows that "the first hex that a Vehicle moves along a road is free." If the Vehicle has speed 0, however, it never gets that first hex of movement because it can't enter another hex. So a damaged Archer loses its Strike & Fade ability, regardless of the presence of a road.

In the former we are saying that it is the raod bonus itself that grants the ability to move into another hex, where as in the altter, it seems like you have to pay for that move along the road first before being allowed to take the bonus.

Additionally, there are several places in the rules and FAQ that refer to a "zero point move" or "move of zero" which implies that some type of Movement and having zero move points are not mutually exclusive. For example:

Moving Zero Hexes: A unit can change facing as its movement. It doesn’t have to move
from one hex to another first.

For the sake of argument, can a unit with Move zero change it's facing (assuming it's not disrupted, obviously)? If it can make that kind of a move, why can't it make the free road movement?

Mot

[Y2UAsk]

You've made my day, I love discussion and analyzing the rules.

Well, I'm not going to 'discuss' the rules, because that's not what this forum is for. I will try to clarify them, however.

Admittedly, this is an odd area of the rules, and I'm not especially happy with the free hex of road movement after you've used your full speed, either.

Your real question here seems to be, why is this allowed and that isn't when they seem to be so similar? And I honestly can't answer that. All I can do is cite the precedents we've been given, which are --

a) If you have speed >0, then you can move normally and qualify for the road bonus anywhere in your move, including after entering what would otherwise be your last hex of movement.

b) If you have speed 0, then you can perform specific, limited types of movement: changing facing, boarding or dismounting transport. You don't, however, qualify for any type of road movement, including the free hex bonus. In other words, speed 0 enables you to move within your hex but not to leave it, even by road bonus.

Note that within the letter of the rules, there's a crucial difference between speed 0 and using all your movement. Nowhere in the rules is there any mention of movement points or of expending speed points during movement. Speed measures how many hexes you can move, and some types of terrain count as two hexes instead of one. If you have speed 4 and you move 1 hex, that doesn't mean you now have speed 3 'remaining'. You have speed 4 and you've moved one of your 4 allowed hexes. If you've moved 4 hexes, that doesn't mean you now have speed 0. It means you have speed 4 and you've moved 4 hexes. If you truly have speed 0, you can't leave your hex.

Steve

[Motdc]

1. I saw that you are moving to the new forum, that's great news!

2. Sorry for describing what you do as "discussing", I didn't mean it in any negative way.

3. I'm not really clear which precedent it is that you were referring too that overrides the definition of Road Bonus. In other words, where does this come from: "You don't, however, qualify for any type of road movement, including the free hex bonus." (Or is it simply a matter of "the game designers never intended for units with speed zero to get a Road Bonus")?

4. At this point, the result of this ruling is effectively covered with something along the lines of the following?

Road Bonus = "Each phase, the first hex that a Vehicle [b] with speed 1 or more[\b] moves along a road is free. It doesn’t count against the number of hexes the unit can move."

Please note, I am in know way implying that is an official definition. It's just the simplest phrasing I can think of to make sure I'm clear on the official stance.

That's it for me. I'll be sure to post future rules questions in the new forum!

[Y2UAsk]

3. I don't think any of this "overrides" the road bonus. It's all a question of when it applies and when it doesn't, and that's not entirely clear from the RaW. The intent, however, was that a unit with speed 0 can't leave its hex.

4. There's nothing wrong with your phrasing, but I don't think that particular clarification is necessary. It's sort of like saying, "McDonald's is giving away free hamburgers" when you're at Burger King. You can't take your first hex of movement for free because you don't get a first hex of movement*, just like you don't qualify for those free hamburgers because you're in the wrong place.

Steve

* While I try to discourage overly pedantic parsing of the rules, it's often necessary. Note that the rule states, "The first hex that a vehicle moves along a road is free." It doesn't state that you get a free hex of movement under any and all conditions. There's an implication that you must have the capability to enter that hex in order to get the bonus, and that implication has been hammered into stone by our rulings here. The only place where I feel that the interpretation has been a bit dodgy is in allowing one more hex of movement along a road after the unit has moved as far as its speed allows. You can make a case either way from the printed rules, but I've been assured by the designers that that was their intent, and that's good enough for me.